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haikaiTALKS Q 27: a saturday gathering

*** Q #27 ***

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haikaiTALKS Q #27: a saturday gathering_under the banyan tree

host: Kala Ramesh


Hearty Congratulations, to Ashish Narain!

Kavitha has picked Asish Narain’s answer as the best reply to her Q!


For last week’s discussion, click here:


Listen to what Kavitha has to say:


Dear Kala

My heartfelt thanks to you and Lakshmi for allowing me to present forward Q#26 for haikaiTALKS.


Though the responses were few they were profound and constructive.


I would like to thank Lakshmi Iyer, Neena Singh, Robert Kingston, Shalini Pattabiraman, Tish Davis, Vandana Parashar, Ashish Narain and you (Kala Ramesh) for stopping by and sharing your valid thoughts.


Robert Kingston, the first to attempt the question and share Nick Virgilio’s haiku along with his own, threw light on how we at times struggle to find and finish our lines while others flow in naturally. His haiku was simplistic yet was like a bird’s eye view. Thank you for sharing your ku with us.


Shalini Pattabiraman shared her ku along with her thoughts about being one with the universal consciousness to bring simplicity into our writing. The whole idea of transcendence and flowing in shapelessness is beautifully depicted through her writing. Thank you, Shalini for sharing.


Thank you Kala for stopping by and sharing your understanding of 'karumi' and the importance of equanimity in thoughts, word and action to write a simple yet deep ku. Your ku depicted just that. The whole idea of transcendence is beautifully captured in both your and Shalini’s ku.


Lakshmi Iyer pulled strings from my haiku and also shared her thoughts through her deep insights. I loved her haiku where grandma knits a purple sky. The ability to look at things with a childlike wonder yet attach depth to them is simply beautiful.


Tish Davis had captured the essence of haiku through the simplistic ku. Tish’s perspective about haiku being uncluttered and being balanced deeply reflects in the ku. Thank you, Tish Davis.


Neena Singh thank you for stopping by. I loved the way Neena has defined simplicity- uncomplicated and light. She has focussed on the truthfulness of haiku. Show as you see through her haiku. Loved both her ku especially the hummingbird one.


Ashish Narain’s take on presenting a ku non-judgementally and leaving it for the reader to have their own unique experience is a different take from the others. I simply liked this take where Ashish Narain meant that the ku should leave something for the reader to imagine, ponder, and wonder about. It shouldn’t dictate how the reader has to react and create a space for the experience. His haiku, simple yet deep and elegant, unfurls its layers as you read it again.


So I pass on the baton to Ashish Narain for next week’s question.

Thank you once again.


Sincerely,

Kavitha Sreeraj


>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Now for Ashish Narain’s Q:


Hi Kala,

Thanks for letting me know, and my thanks To Kavitha for picking me up. Here is my question. I fear we will not get many responses to it, but I still feel like asking it.



Thank you, Kavitha for appreciating my response and letting me ask the next question. In a way, your question provoked my one below, so thanks also for forcing me to think more about Haiku!


Simplicity is the heart of haiku. However, simplicity is also the ultimate form of sophistication. Even more so when you combine it with brevity. This often leads to a reliance on stylistic references to suggest more than there are words to say. E.g., the moon is now generally considered to signify autumn and all that goes along with it- growing discomfort, old age etc. This however means that the reader must develop sensitivity to meanings carried by context and implied through nuance, and this could lead to haiku becoming difficult to reach by readers not used to it. Greater reliance on structure and stylistic devices also could potentially detract from spontaneity, which is what Basho tried to infuse into the form.

Q #27

So my question is do you see a trade-off between structure and stylistic elements (like kigos), and spontaneity and accessibility in haiku? If there is, which would you rather choose? If there isn't, can you provide some examples of haiku which do both?


………………………………………………………………………………………………….


Trivenians are given time until midnight of 18th May (IST) - two weeks, because I want our poets to think about this Q. And to share your poems and comments on this topic.


Waiting to read your responses!

your host,

_kala

197 views31 comments

31 Kommentare


Kala Ramesh
Kala Ramesh
13. Mai 2022

So my question is do you see a trade-off between structure and stylistic elements (like kigos), and spontaneity and accessibility in haiku? If there is, which would you rather choose? If there isn't, can you provide some examples of haiku which do both?

Ashish


>>>


We still follow the lunisolar calendars for all festivals and important occasions. Dates for marriages, housewarming ceremonies, ancestors’ death ceremonies, and many other

occasions are based on the waxing and waning of the moon.


In many traditional homes, birthdays are still celebrated on two days — one according to the Indian (lunisolar) calendar and the other according to the Western calendar. For instance, ‘Buddha Poornima’ (Buddha’s birthday) is a national holiday and is celebrated when…


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Kala Ramesh
Kala Ramesh
16. Mai 2022
Antwort an

But is there one- not to a haiku reader, but what about a less attuned one? Ashish.


>> I agree. but how did we all step into the haikai river? Did we know about kigo words ... did we know about Kire, Jux? No!

>>>

But there have been muki (seasonless haiku) even during the masters' times. And did you read the part about the interview I quoted?

That in itself is revealing and tells us how to take your Q forward, Ashish.

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Vandana Parashar
Vandana Parashar
12. Mai 2022

An excellent question, Ashish. We all have experienced ourselves at crossroads at some point or the other. I find myself more comfortable with senryu, so I haven’t bothered much about kigo while writing. Having said that, I have written a few haiku too without kigo, but I feel that they have done well because of spontaneity and simplicity. One such example is—


in it together

in it alone

dawn chorus


It doesn’t have a traditional single cut too, but somehow this works.

We can have traditional elements and yet have the simplicity and spontaneity. One such example which I wrote in my early years is—


one-way street

the fragrance of jasmine

everywhere


I have been a bit experimental too,…


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Antwort an

In it together… that one…cannot believe how much i like that one!!! a masterpiece

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lakshmi iyer
lakshmi iyer
10. Mai 2022

Thanks Ashish for the lovely question. In one of the sessions of our Gurukulam program with K Ramesh, we were introduced to the 'essential qualities required whilst submitting haiku' from the Heron's Nest and believe it or not; we all were wonderstruck. We hadn't read them at all. That was a great discussion. I am still struggling to get at least one of my haiku in that journal.


From what I have come so far with the very little haiku, I feel

* both structure and style (kigo) and

* spontaneity and accessibility

are equally important.

* They have their own perspectives. Both can be mixed. It is your own experience which drives you to write a haiku. They all…


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Antwort an

Looove that dentures one. So much warmth in that humorous moment

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neena singh
neena singh
10. Mai 2022

Thanks dear Kavitha for your detailed response. Glad you liked the hummingbird haiku.

Congratulation Ashish - you have asked a deep question that needs time to ponder and respond. Would it be a haiku without a kigo? Would it not be a senryu? Maybe I haven’t understood your Q yet.

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neena singh
neena singh
14. Mai 2022
Antwort an

Thanks for the response Ashish. In my understanding, (limited albeit), kigo/kigo words set a tone and backdrop to the haiku to enhance the experience for both regular haiku readers and first-time readers. I don't think it makes the haiku any less accessible for first-time readers. The kire or cut forms the backbone and can be called the soul in haiku. It brings into focus the images that run parallel and the space between them, so my response would be the same.

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mona bedi
mona bedi
07. Mai 2022

Another example : lingering grief how difficult to mould this clay This one has no traditional elements. snow flurries the war knows no timeline Published in Mainichi pottery class I etch your name on the clay pot Published Haiku dialogue

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Kavita Ratna
Kavita Ratna
16. Mai 2022
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